Still not far enough. Keep the D, but call it Decline…..as in Permanent Decline. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, or doesn’t have to be, but knowing this System, along the way to zero, it will mete out punishment o plenty on it sway down. Speaking of pain, if this System were still in incline, it would necessarily mean exponentially more pain and suffering for all living things on the planet. As no one would wish pain and suffering on you, they should also not wish pain and suffering on the ecology at large. Rationalizing this way of life is an insult to all/everything who/that suffer at its hands…..and that number is legion.
This is class warfare and the top 2% holds all the cards and gets to keep all the goodies. Permanent decline works better when the pie is divided more equally. The upper class and corporates will continue to take more and more of less and less under the current arrangements.
First to go for the bottom 98%? Medicare. Followed I fear by Social Security and unemployment compensation. Unions have a 6% market share in the private sector. Take them out of the public sector and they are ancient history.
What should go, of course, are tax breaks for overseas business, half the military budget, the oil tax breaks, the mercenaries. What should be added are Eisenhower style taxes on corporations and the rich , regulation of business, the end of corporate “personhood”, and a lot more. It won’t happen as long as “they” control the media and the Supreme Court.
I keep looking at the naming of Clarence Thomas as a big part of this. He was confirmed with the vote of conservative southern Democrats who were scared stiff f the race card. It was a high tech lynching all right but not as advertised.
Losing warps a society in a bad way bringing out mean impulses ,revenge, and conspiracy theories. Vietnam did not prove to be liberating. Instead, it tied us to an overly expensive “professional” military that was politically harder to control. 9/11 brought the Patriot Act and an era of Republican power that even elections have not shaken. A drop in living standards for 95% of the population on a permanent basis should be even worse.
David, regardless of how the whole is distributed, the overall is now in decline. I agree with you about how this permanent decline should be managed. A pony for everyone is not the way. Sharing a pool of ponies is a way to manage but eventually the idea of having availability to a pony will have to addressed and dealt with in a constructive manner that is equitable for all.
The sensory inputs people use as a basis for conceiving reality consist of an ever-growing proportion of media and an ever-shrinking proportion of personal interaction. Therefore, the depression is hardly visible. Most people assume that >= 30% unemployment among their family and friends is anomalous, because the media says 10%.
The ramifications extend beyond statistics: the classic bread-demanding mob which has been the engine of revolutions may not ever form. Umbilical high technology may prevent it. Levels of discontent that were historically a critical mass are no longer; one dies in the shadow of the hive mind with no more rancor than a dying cell of tissue.
We associate the internet with viral memes, but perhaps certain kinds of memes do not propagate through it. Revolution, whether constitutional or violent, may belong to this latter group.
(Meaning Revolution in the leftist sense of organizing, syndicalism, appropriation of capital, etc.; not mere cheering on a hypothetical coup d’état which is characteristic of the Tea Party.)
This is class warfare and the top 2% holds all the cards and gets to keep all the goodies. Permanent decline works better when the pie is divided more equally. The upper class and corporates will continue to take more and more of less and less under the current arrangements.
…
What should go, of course, are tax breaks for overseas business, half the military budget, the oil tax breaks, the mercenaries. What should be added are Eisenhower style taxes on corporations and the rich , regulation of business, the end of corporate “personhood”, and a lot more.
For net exports (the blue line), it’s worth recalling that in 1993 Clinton helped get the NAFTA treaty negotiated by Bush ratified. It went into effect Jan. 1, 1994.
The tents where the people who stay to sleep are, are using up all the space, Puerta del Sol is small for such a movement, and they are debating taking out the camp and separate it into the different local areas. Today, 29th May, there have been assemblies in more than 140 places within the Madrid autonomous community, and it’s estimated that more than 25,000 people have met today to form local groups. Many of them will meet one, two or four times a month.
Hundreds of local assemblies held throughout Spain, with women, men, mothers, grandfathers, students, professors, workers, immigrants, real people living a real democracy taking shape in their local areas for the first time in their lives.
…
We held two general assemblies yesterday, May 29. The assembly of local committees in the morning and the general one at night, lasting more than four hours each.
Back before Tunisia, Egypt, and Wisconsin, we had the u.s. election, and I was observing (again) that representative democracy has broken down (the will of the majority is no longer considered in the legislation that is passed), and as a result we were/are going to require direct democracy. I wondered then what that was going to look like in a country of over 310 million people. Maybe Spain is showing us.
What should go, of course, are tax breaks for overseas business, half the military budget, the oil tax breaks, the mercenaries. What should be added are Eisenhower style taxes on corporations and the rich , regulation of business, the end of corporate “personhood”, and a lot more.
Under the “and a lot more” umbrella might be the two largest sectors of the economy that need to be reformed:
– the medical services industry (often referred to by the euphemism “health care”–out of respect for George Orwell’s work, we should describe the sector more accurately). Based on OECD data, the amount of money spent unproductively on this sector could be as much as $1.25 trillion per year.
– the “financial” “services” “industry” (this term they invented is also pure deception. It might be better termed as the Parasitic Crime Syndicate.) I don’t know how much of a drain on the economy this “sector” is but one statistic is telling: In 1979 the PCS made about 8% of all corporate profits. By 2006, it was over 40% of all corporate profits. And that’s the public data. Crime syndicates are known for keeping a lot of information about their profits secret.
and you’ll notice they beat the shit out of the Spanish protesters. Newspapers like the Guardian insinuated the protesters were to blame for the bloodshed and violence with language they used. the steady and gradual confiscation of freedom, “things of value” like jobs, income are the main not so hidden goal anymore. Depression in all the areas, not just in matter of money.
the media continues to slant anything of value. The Idiocracy is well underway.
bread and circuses, American Style. Do any of the local or national newspapers/media say anything about how effectively Americans are being screwed by anyone? Do they say it’s wrong to cheat, steal or kill. nope. entertainment is their focus, day after day. Not a word about what is happening in Europe North Africa or other subjects that might inform the rest of Americans about how this Ponzi scheme is being played out. that we are not alone in the scamming. Hey we got fat Christ Christie taking helicopters to his son’s baseball game while cutting teachers’ salary and taxcuts for the rich. and now the latest, Weiner’s wiener, courtesy of the Fox propaganda network/et al.
Depression is a mild word for what is and has been happening. but not a negative word from the powers that be who own the media, both local, national and otherwise. the Media is part of the problem. i guess “Arbeit macht frei” is what we are supposed to believe now. we are headed in that direction if things don’t change.
a wonderfully orchestrated plan working its’ way to the desired goal. Depression is the least of the words to be used here.
“30% unemployment among their family and friends is anomalous, because the media says 10%”
The media and our hopey changey president. Let’s be fair here: Wolf Blitzer didn’t decide not to consider a larger stimulus or a WPA-style jobs program.
Wolf Blitzer didn’t decide not to consider a larger stimulus or a WPA-style jobs program.
And at least as significantly, he (obama) decided:
– not to end the two largest military occupations, and substantially reduce the amount of money that was allocated to this
– not to end the drug companies/medical equipment makers/ins. cos. monopolies
– not to nationalize and shut down the insolvent large banks
– not to reverse the bush/cheney tax policy in 2009 and signed up for continuing that tax policy at the end of 2010
Ian, you may not realize it but the word “depression” was adopted in the ’30s as a euphemism. The real term used in the 19th century and earlier as well as the early 20th century was “financial panic”, which describes the current situation perfectly..
Re revolution à la Spain, Egypt, et. al. — I’m working with a bunch of people on a big — and I do mean big — non-violent action in DC in October. Will post the link as soon as we go public with the website (in a few days). Will the police beat us and chase us out? I don’t know. Will we succeed? I don’t know. But I think there’s a lot of anger out there, and we’re hoping to tap it.
Depression now has more weight than financial panic, ever since the Great Depression. A financial panic sounds like something which comes and goes quickly.
Wow, I’m in a foul mood. Seeing someone link to Kos talking about the price of austerity makes me ill. Back in 2009, January 2009, is when people like Kos needed to turn on Obama hard for doing the wrong things out the door, and they didn’t. That refusal then determined what is happening now.
I don’t think “panic” is appropriate any longer. In those days, the sky was the limit in regards to growth, and the booms and busts that formed what was termed the “panics” were growing pains. That’s not what’s happening today. It is an overall decline, the Plutocrats know it, and are managing it by concentrating their wealth at the speed of greed squared.
His supporters tell me those are “humanitarian interventions” now, so it’s good that he has escalated them.
Next time you talk with his supporters, please tell them that the occupations are profit-making enterprises. Humanitarian interventions are not activities that done for private profit. If his supporters want him to engage in humanitarian interventions, then they’ll need for him to end the contracts with private companies and start with government employees and non-profit organizations.
There is a simple pattern behind all of the proposed cuts to government spending made since last November’s election:
– If the program is carried out by a contract(s) with private companies, then the program is not cut
– If the program is carried out by government employees, the the program is cut
Morocco Bama
Still not far enough. Keep the D, but call it Decline…..as in Permanent Decline. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, or doesn’t have to be, but knowing this System, along the way to zero, it will mete out punishment o plenty on it sway down. Speaking of pain, if this System were still in incline, it would necessarily mean exponentially more pain and suffering for all living things on the planet. As no one would wish pain and suffering on you, they should also not wish pain and suffering on the ecology at large. Rationalizing this way of life is an insult to all/everything who/that suffer at its hands…..and that number is legion.
David Kowalski
Decline for whom?
This is class warfare and the top 2% holds all the cards and gets to keep all the goodies. Permanent decline works better when the pie is divided more equally. The upper class and corporates will continue to take more and more of less and less under the current arrangements.
First to go for the bottom 98%? Medicare. Followed I fear by Social Security and unemployment compensation. Unions have a 6% market share in the private sector. Take them out of the public sector and they are ancient history.
What should go, of course, are tax breaks for overseas business, half the military budget, the oil tax breaks, the mercenaries. What should be added are Eisenhower style taxes on corporations and the rich , regulation of business, the end of corporate “personhood”, and a lot more. It won’t happen as long as “they” control the media and the Supreme Court.
I keep looking at the naming of Clarence Thomas as a big part of this. He was confirmed with the vote of conservative southern Democrats who were scared stiff f the race card. It was a high tech lynching all right but not as advertised.
Losing warps a society in a bad way bringing out mean impulses ,revenge, and conspiracy theories. Vietnam did not prove to be liberating. Instead, it tied us to an overly expensive “professional” military that was politically harder to control. 9/11 brought the Patriot Act and an era of Republican power that even elections have not shaken. A drop in living standards for 95% of the population on a permanent basis should be even worse.
Morocco Bama
David, regardless of how the whole is distributed, the overall is now in decline. I agree with you about how this permanent decline should be managed. A pony for everyone is not the way. Sharing a pool of ponies is a way to manage but eventually the idea of having availability to a pony will have to addressed and dealt with in a constructive manner that is equitable for all.
Cloud
Speculation:
The sensory inputs people use as a basis for conceiving reality consist of an ever-growing proportion of media and an ever-shrinking proportion of personal interaction. Therefore, the depression is hardly visible. Most people assume that >= 30% unemployment among their family and friends is anomalous, because the media says 10%.
The ramifications extend beyond statistics: the classic bread-demanding mob which has been the engine of revolutions may not ever form. Umbilical high technology may prevent it. Levels of discontent that were historically a critical mass are no longer; one dies in the shadow of the hive mind with no more rancor than a dying cell of tissue.
We associate the internet with viral memes, but perhaps certain kinds of memes do not propagate through it. Revolution, whether constitutional or violent, may belong to this latter group.
Cloud
(Meaning Revolution in the leftist sense of organizing, syndicalism, appropriation of capital, etc.; not mere cheering on a hypothetical coup d’état which is characteristic of the Tea Party.)
anon2525
This is class warfare and the top 2% holds all the cards and gets to keep all the goodies. Permanent decline works better when the pie is divided more equally. The upper class and corporates will continue to take more and more of less and less under the current arrangements.
…
What should go, of course, are tax breaks for overseas business, half the military budget, the oil tax breaks, the mercenaries. What should be added are Eisenhower style taxes on corporations and the rich , regulation of business, the end of corporate “personhood”, and a lot more.
Here’s what it looks like in a graph:
https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/fredgraph.png?graph_id=45260 (h/t Matt Stoller)
For net exports (the blue line), it’s worth recalling that in 1993 Clinton helped get the NAFTA treaty negotiated by Bush ratified. It went into effect Jan. 1, 1994.
anon2525
Meaning Revolution in the leftist sense of organizing,…
In Spain, this has been going on recently (from two separate observers):
Letter from Madrid
The tents where the people who stay to sleep are, are using up all the space, Puerta del Sol is small for such a movement, and they are debating taking out the camp and separate it into the different local areas. Today, 29th May, there have been assemblies in more than 140 places within the Madrid autonomous community, and it’s estimated that more than 25,000 people have met today to form local groups. Many of them will meet one, two or four times a month.
Revolt in Spain
Hundreds of local assemblies held throughout Spain, with women, men, mothers, grandfathers, students, professors, workers, immigrants, real people living a real democracy taking shape in their local areas for the first time in their lives.
…
We held two general assemblies yesterday, May 29. The assembly of local committees in the morning and the general one at night, lasting more than four hours each.
Back before Tunisia, Egypt, and Wisconsin, we had the u.s. election, and I was observing (again) that representative democracy has broken down (the will of the majority is no longer considered in the legislation that is passed), and as a result we were/are going to require direct democracy. I wondered then what that was going to look like in a country of over 310 million people. Maybe Spain is showing us.
anon2525
What should go, of course, are tax breaks for overseas business, half the military budget, the oil tax breaks, the mercenaries. What should be added are Eisenhower style taxes on corporations and the rich , regulation of business, the end of corporate “personhood”, and a lot more.
Under the “and a lot more” umbrella might be the two largest sectors of the economy that need to be reformed:
– the medical services industry (often referred to by the euphemism “health care”–out of respect for George Orwell’s work, we should describe the sector more accurately). Based on OECD data, the amount of money spent unproductively on this sector could be as much as $1.25 trillion per year.
– the “financial” “services” “industry” (this term they invented is also pure deception. It might be better termed as the Parasitic Crime Syndicate.) I don’t know how much of a drain on the economy this “sector” is but one statistic is telling: In 1979 the PCS made about 8% of all corporate profits. By 2006, it was over 40% of all corporate profits. And that’s the public data. Crime syndicates are known for keeping a lot of information about their profits secret.
Bernard
and you’ll notice they beat the shit out of the Spanish protesters. Newspapers like the Guardian insinuated the protesters were to blame for the bloodshed and violence with language they used. the steady and gradual confiscation of freedom, “things of value” like jobs, income are the main not so hidden goal anymore. Depression in all the areas, not just in matter of money.
the media continues to slant anything of value. The Idiocracy is well underway.
bread and circuses, American Style. Do any of the local or national newspapers/media say anything about how effectively Americans are being screwed by anyone? Do they say it’s wrong to cheat, steal or kill. nope. entertainment is their focus, day after day. Not a word about what is happening in Europe North Africa or other subjects that might inform the rest of Americans about how this Ponzi scheme is being played out. that we are not alone in the scamming. Hey we got fat Christ Christie taking helicopters to his son’s baseball game while cutting teachers’ salary and taxcuts for the rich. and now the latest, Weiner’s wiener, courtesy of the Fox propaganda network/et al.
Depression is a mild word for what is and has been happening. but not a negative word from the powers that be who own the media, both local, national and otherwise. the Media is part of the problem. i guess “Arbeit macht frei” is what we are supposed to believe now. we are headed in that direction if things don’t change.
a wonderfully orchestrated plan working its’ way to the desired goal. Depression is the least of the words to be used here.
Notorious P.A.T.
I have been.
Notorious P.A.T.
“30% unemployment among their family and friends is anomalous, because the media says 10%”
The media and our hopey changey president. Let’s be fair here: Wolf Blitzer didn’t decide not to consider a larger stimulus or a WPA-style jobs program.
anon2525
Wolf Blitzer didn’t decide not to consider a larger stimulus or a WPA-style jobs program.
And at least as significantly, he (obama) decided:
– not to end the two largest military occupations, and substantially reduce the amount of money that was allocated to this
– not to end the drug companies/medical equipment makers/ins. cos. monopolies
– not to nationalize and shut down the insolvent large banks
– not to reverse the bush/cheney tax policy in 2009 and signed up for continuing that tax policy at the end of 2010
Albert De
Ian, you may not realize it but the word “depression” was adopted in the ’30s as a euphemism. The real term used in the 19th century and earlier as well as the early 20th century was “financial panic”, which describes the current situation perfectly..
Lisa Simeone
Re revolution à la Spain, Egypt, et. al. — I’m working with a bunch of people on a big — and I do mean big — non-violent action in DC in October. Will post the link as soon as we go public with the website (in a few days). Will the police beat us and chase us out? I don’t know. Will we succeed? I don’t know. But I think there’s a lot of anger out there, and we’re hoping to tap it.
Ian Welsh
Depression now has more weight than financial panic, ever since the Great Depression. A financial panic sounds like something which comes and goes quickly.
Ian Welsh
Wow, I’m in a foul mood. Seeing someone link to Kos talking about the price of austerity makes me ill. Back in 2009, January 2009, is when people like Kos needed to turn on Obama hard for doing the wrong things out the door, and they didn’t. That refusal then determined what is happening now.
Notorious P.A.T.
“he (obama) decided not to end the two largest military occupations”
His supporters tell me those are “humanitarian interventions” now, so it’s good that he has escalated them.
Morocco Bama
I don’t think “panic” is appropriate any longer. In those days, the sky was the limit in regards to growth, and the booms and busts that formed what was termed the “panics” were growing pains. That’s not what’s happening today. It is an overall decline, the Plutocrats know it, and are managing it by concentrating their wealth at the speed of greed squared.
anon2525
His supporters tell me those are “humanitarian interventions” now, so it’s good that he has escalated them.
Next time you talk with his supporters, please tell them that the occupations are profit-making enterprises. Humanitarian interventions are not activities that done for private profit. If his supporters want him to engage in humanitarian interventions, then they’ll need for him to end the contracts with private companies and start with government employees and non-profit organizations.
There is a simple pattern behind all of the proposed cuts to government spending made since last November’s election:
– If the program is carried out by a contract(s) with private companies, then the program is not cut
– If the program is carried out by government employees, the the program is cut